Writing : Writers: Am I biting off more than I can chew? And help with that?

SFI,

First off, the membership is definitely worth it.  Both the craft essays and the workshop have made a gigantic difference in my writing.  I couldn't recommend it more. 

Second, were I you (and mind you I'm currently only a middling-successful short-story writer, so take my advice with a grain of salt) I would concentrate on short stories and honing your skill set before setting off on breaking your ass on a (set of) novels.  You can hone your craft a lot more directly by working on shorter stuff.  That way, when you sit down and spend two years writing your first big book, your chances of achieving your goals with it will be higher.  It still won't be perfect and you'll still have a shitload of work to do, but I think you'll be closer to hitting the mark if you do some target practicing first.

And now I'll step aside and let the novelists of the group tender their wisdoms.

Novels are hard. Your first novel, and likely your first several, are probably going to suck really hard. Not because you're a bad writer, but because there's a lot to learn.

And definitely, sitting down to write is the hardest part. The dreaming is the easy part (or that's how it works for me, anyway). Actually sitting down to write can be really tough in a busy schedule. I love to do it, but it's not easy when you're constantly exhausted and never have enough time. I cook 3 meals a day for my girlfriend and I, and I've got 5 classes I'm taking this semester. Add in regular life stuff and it doesn't leave a lot of time for reading, let alone writing. But if you love it, you stick with it.

Don't be afraid to take some time off from the big ideas to work on the small ones. You don't have to go exclusively one way or the other, but you can learn simultaneously from both. Either way, the more you get your ass in the chair to work, the better off you'll be.

EDIT - Oh, and the membership is definitely worth it. It's really quite cheap on the whole, so try it out for a couple months and see what you think. It takes some work since you have to critique the work of others too, but you'll likely find the advice helpful, and the craft essays are great stuff.

I can relate. It wasn't until I turned 24, a few months ago that I realized that it might be nicer to just focus on smaller projects. That way you get to bathe in the awesome feeling of finishing something in a relative small amount of time. A feeling that is quite unique and it pushes you into the next thing. 

What might also happen is that you end up with a string of smaller projects, that you keep hopping between, and that might take up a similar amount of time as one really big project.

Or any combination of the two, but that's fine, as long as you're writing and experimenting and occasionally finishing something.

My advice: Start to write, keep writing, finish your story.

And like Utah said, short stories offer up a great playground, a perfect way to find your voice and strong suits. So if it ends up sucking, it's only a couple of pages of suck and you probably learned something in the process.

I agree with JGB, but I will add that Michael is also right. Your first novel isn't likely to be something you're going to want to show people. I actually just went through my office and found my first three novel length stories... you won't see me workshopping those any time soon.

I do think that if you're having issues with "passion" for writing, short stories are a good way to prime yourself. It doesn't take months to get the story out, and writing shorter works definitely helped me structure chapters better, but it's a different thing all together. There are things you can do in a short story that would never work in a novel and vice verse.

Are you sure you want to write a novel? If that strikes your fancy, then YES, write a novel. The hardest part about writing a novel is realizing that it's never really over, never really THE END. First draft, second...twentieth...when does it stop? So if you know you're going to have to rewrite it, then write it. 

If you discover that maybe it's just a longer short story, like a novelette or a novella, then write that. Build the story up around your characters, and make it personal to them. 

I wrote my first novel before ever even attempting a short story. Four exhilirating and experimental years, followed by two frustrating ones trying to sell it. Novels and shorts are two different processes, though. While I agree that you should get your writing and structural chops down first, it doesn't have to be short stories. I wrote film scripts, poems/songs, and tons of ad copy first. If the tale that's nagging at you requires the epic palette that a novel offers, then it does. I would, however, recommend that any first-time novelist outline the entire book before writing word one. Leave room for some fun and flexibility, but at least you won't find yourself at some dead end three years in that'll take another two to dig out of. You also gotta be sure the subject matter is something that will keep you excited for years and years and years, because the process doesn't end with publishing; you're gonna be talking about that book forever. It's like the dad who locks the kid in a closet with a carton of cigarettes. "Smoke up, Johnny!"

Good luck!

I'm reading these comments about short stories and novels being completely different things, and I just don't see it that way. Maybe it's my own approach to writing, but novels, to me, are just long short stories or, rather, multiple short stories in one. Whereas, in a short story, you may only have one or two points of conflict to work out and resolve, a novel will likely have more conflicts and more themes to unravel through more rising action events.

It depends what you're doing, of course, but things like scene, character, and dialog aren't really going to change between the shorter and longer forms. Completely different levels of commitment, but I see them on the same plane of existence at least.

The necessary depth of character development is the primary difference to me. In a novel, you gotta know everything about them. Same for the other characters. They may only make one or two "choices" in a short, and sometimes that character might even be sort of an empty vessel to illustrate a situation or allegory, but that won't fly in a novel. There's the universe-building, the geography and periphery, the research, the insane chronologies and timelines, more rigid structure, resolution, etc. The pacing of a novel is something short fiction writers are often unskilled at. Some of the best shorts are open-ended, and may even be more of a vignette (I like to use the analogy of a biopsy) than a "story" with beginning/middle/end. You can get away with surface-level research for most shorts; they don't require the same immersion. But if you're going to live with a book for, say, three years, man, you'd better be fascinated. True, an excellent short story can embody those above traits, too, but it's uncommon.

I could jump right in with a short story and get a healthy number of words down the first day, wrap it up in a week, but with a novel, I probably wouldn't even think about any prose for its first month.

I've read a few novels that read like short stories (all by young-ish authors), and they don't work for me. The scope and ambition are too small, universes underdeveloped, and it feels like they didn't put the work in. Same goes for some novellas.

Hi SF1734, my two cents on this is pretty well the same as Jeffrey's first comment..

If you want to write a novel, write a novel. I'm sure some will disagree, but writing short stories is to writing as soldering is to welding. If you want practice at the thing you want to to, then practice that thing.

Not sure about the soldering/welding analogy but let's not pick holes: I agree that you should spend what precious time you have doing the thing you want to rather than doing something that feels more like a rehearsal for it. If it's the novel you're taken with then go with it, but I have to say that it sounds like you've got a massive project in mind here - two series each of three novels? I had to go back and read that twice just to make sure I'd read that right, because you're brave to go for a series when you're not even certain you can write the first one! If staying power is your issue then trust me when I tell you it doesn't get any easier when you've got the long haul of a series in front of you. 

I'll talk as little about my own work as possible, but here's how I know what it's like to have your problem:

I'm pretty seasoned at writing long drafts. I started out writing fanfiction ten years ago, and wrote several novel length drafts of epic proportion. I decided to go original story in 2010 and no surprise, I got an epic draft out of my first attempt. Now I've split that into a series of three after deciding it's more managable that way. 50,000 words into draft three of the first book and I'm REALLY feeling the fatigue of this project setting in. I love it enough to keep it going, but some days I just hate it. I know I can finish this first book and get it to a standard where I'd send it out and hope for the best. I refuse to let it defeat me. I've had some workshop feedback, some help from friends, a bit of family support too, but I'm not quitting my day job any time soon. I don't know if I'll ever write the other two books, the way I'm feeling at the moment. If my first sells, I just might. If it doesn't, I like to think I'll do them anyway because I'll just feel the need to.

That's the kind of thing I think you're letting yourself in for if you go for a series. All that I've just detailed is technically my first go at something serious, but I already knew I had the staying power and that I could complete a project, and I knew what the reward felt like when I got it - that, I think, is the biggest motivator I have at the moment. The way I see it you've got two options:

(1) If you really love this idea you've got, go with it and make this the project that teaches you how to write and how to keep doing it until you've got something workable. If it doesn't work out after a while, chuck it and try again. The warning with that is that it can feel pretty gutting if a massive project collapses with the first book. If you're concerned it will devastate you too much, perhaps try:

(2) Try a standalone novel that's not going to turn into a series. Or perhaps it will if it turns out to work and there's bait for a sequel at the end, but don't have a series length project in mind when you start. If you go with this option, you can always come back to the series project when you've honed your skill set a bit more, have an established writing routine and genuinely feel more confidant. Or you might wind up thinking that the series idea is crap compared with what you're now working on.

Bottom line, you take a calculated gamble on any writing you put on paper. If you keep trying long enough though, the chances are you'll feel as good about your ideas when you put them on paper as you do when they're in your head. 

Short stories are excellent to test out new voices, pov's, tenses, styles, etc. The other benefit is you can finish them in a short amount of time. Don't underestimate the feely-goodness of finishing something whereas a novel is a long, slog.

You, like everyone, are probably pressed with time with life commitments. However, I would suggest figuring out a way to get the best of both worlds. Work on your novel. Then when you need a break, change gears and bang out a short. During times of research for the novel, work on stories completely unrelated. Or write short stories about the characters in your novel who may or may not be the big players. This will get you closer to the world.

There's no right or wrong way, you just need to write and you need to enjoy the work you're doing. Figure out that combo that works best for you and you'll produce work you're proud of.

As far as me, I started a novel and stopped. I don't feel I'm adequately skilled enough to handle what I'm going for and my focus right now is on short stories and I rather enjoy it. I have 25k of a novel done and a general idea of where I'm going. It's never too far from my thoughts and I can access that world anytime I want. There is a lot of writing that takes place away from the page, too. 

When I get mine then we'll talk.

As always, take whatever advice works for you.

IMO, start with short fiction, even flash fiction, and work on craft—narrative hook, conflict/resolution, setting, dialogue, character, plot, etc. as you get more comfortable and find your voice, expand outward from 1,000 words to 3,000 words to 5,000 words. crawl, walk, jog, run, sprint, marathon. i'd spend a YEAR doing this. take classes if you can. read ON WRITING by Stephen King, and WRITING 21ST CENTURY FICTION by Donald Maas (a huge agent), and the WONDERBOOK by Jeff VanderMeer. THEN, if you feel like you have the chops, and have FINISHED stories, sent them out, gotten published, consider a novel. to a new writer, spending a year, or YEARS writing something that may not work (most first novels are terrible. mine was, for sure) can just crush an author. 

i have a column, Storyville, here at LR, maybe start with this one: http://litreactor.com/columns/storyville-finding-your-voice

good luck!

If you don't like writing, that don't write. Maybe there's another medium that you would prefer to work in such as playwriting or screenwriting.

I don't think there's anything wrong with a newer writer tackling a trilogy of novels, but it's likely that they won't be good enough to publish. But that's fine. Just use them as practice like you would do if you had focused on short stories. Some people just aren't interested in writing stories. Why force it? Although if you do a workshop, you're going to get better feedback from stories than from a novel excerpt.