Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.May 9, 2012 - 3:12pm
JYH—I enjoy really skillful exposition, in the hands of somebody like Cody Goodfellow or James Ellroy (who does an amazing job in AMERICAN TABLOID at dropping huge amounts of exposition in between the more emotional character-driven sections). But my exposition usually clunks when I do it in chunks, so I try to weave in back story and world-building through more subtle character observations and trust the reader to fill in the gaps.
Very early on I used to open up with a lot of scenery and character description until I got a workshop note from a lady named Nina Kiriki Hoffman. It was three pages into the story, and her note just read:
“Your story begins here!”
And she was so right. Ever since then I’ve gone for the high conflict “in media res” opening, often in the form of a character thought that can almost be seen as a thesis statement (although sometimes it’s just a provocation).
Forms of exposition I am guilty of having used in the past: The Bad Guy Lecture, The Scientist’s Explanation, and the rightly reviled Tangential Character Telling the Central Character Something They Would Obviously Already Have Known. If I knew I was using one of these, I kept it as short and tight as possible. Lessen the degree of the sin, I guess.
I’m also guilty of using Character Description Given Via Self-Assessment in Mirror, but that’s a whole other issue.
Flaminia—Nice to hear from you, and glad the book reached your new location. Thanks for cracking the thing open; hope you enjoy it when the time is right. In the meantime, enjoy the sunshine and potential future husbands.
Otis—Thanks! Really nice to hear “Trigger Variation” worked for you. As Pete points out, there are some derivative elements in there (the odes to Fight Club and The Warriors are pretty overt), but this was, I think, my last “disturbed child of an alcoholic” story (see also: “Dissociative Skills”, “Saturn’s Game”, “Cortical Reorganization”, etc.) and I feel like the ending finally exorcised a lot of my feelings on the matter. I’ve now transitioned from a son to a neurotic father, which led me to a much-increased level of empathy for parents, and stories like “Cathedral Mother” and “Laws of Virulence.”
“States of Glass” was another story, like “Persistence Hunting,” that I vacillated on including, but I’m glad it’s in there, and I appreciate your and Pete’s comments.
I don’t personally read in genre. I read writers, and I’ll follow a great writer into whatever kind of story they want to tell. I just have to hope that people who dig the weirder stuff will find something to like in a story like “States of Glass.” So far there hasn’t been too much static about WE LIVE INSIDE YOU having so much less overtly Bizarro content than ANGEL DUST APOCALYPSE, which is cool.
Pete—Man, you’re thorough. This rivals your epic WARMED & BOUND session…
Sounds like that fungus could make for an awesome story. Just the visual of all those human bodies amassing on some huge tree until the branches broke with their weight, that could be great. Skipp and Goodfellow did a fungal zombie book for Leisure called SPORE that’s sitting on my TBR. Makes me want to move it forward in the queue.
Thanks for mentioning “Consumerism.” That’s about as close as I get to writing comedy, though it’s kind of pitch black. But I had a lot of fun writing that and its predecessor “Priapism.” Both were inspired, somehow, maybe tonally, by the Incandenza mattress fixing scene from INFINITE JEST.
Re: Musty Cow’s Teat of Death—There’s a reason that’s in the B-Sides section, and I try to warn people in the lead-in, about how odd that thing is. There’s a slim narrative in there about two neighbors and a dog and a barbecue, but it’s mostly buried by the contrivances of the experimental form. I think it’s fun as an experiment, and I dig how playful and silly the language is (some really funny sentences, I think), but it’s definitely way fucking out there.
That Courage the Cowardly Dog comic is about perfect (though the ending of “Mercy” is a little more “lady or the tiger”).
At the HPL Film Fest this weekend for three days of weird movies, books, and beer. See you guys on Monday.
Pete
from Detroit is reading Red DragonMay 9, 2012 - 7:18pm
Jeremy said: Man, you’re thorough. This rivals your epic WARMED & BOUND session…
I wanted to say a little something about each of the stories I really liked. I guess I didn't realize I had really liked most of them.
What happened with the Warmed and Bound discussion was this - if every one of those authors that said they wanted to discuss the book would have made just 1 post, it would have been a great discussion. But instead, barely anybody posted (including readers). Meanwhile I know a shitload of people read the book. I decided to try something crazy to spark discussion. Didn't really work, but it was an awesome exercise.
Also - You just sold me on Spore, and maybe my first Skipp and Goodfellow all in one read.
Chester Pane
from Portland, Oregon is reading The Brief and Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao by Junot DiazMay 9, 2012 - 10:56pm
Mustycow’steatofdeath™
JRJ said:
I don’t personally read in genre. I read writers...
Yes.
Flaminia Ferina
from Umbria is reading stuffMay 21, 2012 - 6:59am
So, I've finally managed some time alone in the mountains and read good part of WLIY.
I'm loving it. Jeremy, your style is fresh and amusing.
The Oarsman: an anti-labelling tale, as I see it. In my mind it sounded like a big fuck you to all those who think they can take others' lives in their hands and declare apocalypse for all. I might have taken it backwards, though.
“Earth, optimistically referred to as Colony 1.” This phrase, golden, gives a practical account of how well condensed is the sentencing in this first story.
When Susurrur Stirs: One of the best in the collection. At this point I had very well become acquainted with your voice. At page 20 I was totally sucked in. I appreciate a good story in 1st person plural.
- Did the idea spawn from a desire of writing in 1st plural, or was this voice the most natural for the account? I am investigating rituals and other phenomena involving possession. Like demonic possession and stuff, so I really dig this story as being about a particular way of being possessed. By a less spiritual entity, maybe.
- I sense a holistic aftertaste to the first 2 stories already. Is this approach part of your cultural background?
Persistence Hunting: This is in second person. I haven't read many collections, but the way you experiment with different voices makes the experience entertaining. We have a guy who gets a high from burglary here, great point of view. You got me laugh out loud at “slaughtered by a Jetta with a butterfly bumper sticker.”
“the heat from her face mixing nicely with your valium/brain damage buzz,” very evocative.
I must say I really appreciate the sexual fantasies you set on the table (like getting aroused by sneaking into houses, I can relate to it). With a dominating culture continually force feeding us lethally boring and gross sex imagery, this comes in like a new kind of springtime.
Snortland. New nomenclature :)
“alternative badass, one who wouldn't trap her in jealousy.” Thank you for this.
And thank you for the Rottweiler named Scarface. I'm a sucker for big dogs' scary names.
The Witness at Dawn: beautiful ghost tale.
Consumerism: An unreliable and haunting narrator. I hope you'll write a novel with Ron and his father. I definitely want to know more about them. The whole idea spells disaster.
“The sun is rising. Your dark night of the soul is over, Ron..” How can't you just love this man? A thrilling kind of love that keeps you away and safe from people like him, of course.
I like the Iroquois culture references.
Trigger Variation: My favorite. Detached 3rd person narration. The main character is awesomely developed. Very up-to-date with all the ganging going on in the world.
“Gorilla physique. A guy prone to misunderstanding nuance.” Description that doesn't need more words.
“Jackson cancelled his query/feigned mental drift.” Gold. Is it just your personal affinity with slashes, or you figured they're particularly suited to render a split personality?
“It was ape heaven.” I'm still giggling at this.
Did you get the idea for this story from a pillow fight flashmob? From a “what if those pillows were filled with iron” frame of thought?
The story raises important questions about preservation of the species: Will the strongest survive, or the smartest? And it seems to end in favor of strength. Or does it?
“Born-again savages.” Is there a reference to the primitivists in Eugene? This is just a lol question.
Enough for now.
Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.May 23, 2012 - 3:27pm
Flaminia_Klla/Cris—Thanks for spending some time in the mountains with my weird book.
Re: When Susurrus Stirs, I thought that using the “We” would be the easiest way to convey a sense of the hive mind, to make the narration more progressively alien as the human voice was subsumed into the ancient perspective of something which didn’t have an ego or conscience to inhibit the forces of consuming and breeding. And also, yeah, I did just want to try it to see if I could make it work as an idea and still tell the story.
If there’s a holistic sensibility present, that must be one of those things my subconscious is coughing up without letting me know…
Re: Consumerism, I don’t know if I could sustain Ron’s father’s voice for novel length (plus- poor Ron). It takes a while to churn up all that pompous verbal abuse.
Re: Trigger Variation, I really like the forward slashes as a quick way to condense information and establish a kind of staccato rhythm to the language, esp. when the story is on the hard-boiled end of things.
The story was partly inspired by the ultra straight edge Hardline movement and by some of the straight edge folks I knew when I lived in Olympia. These guys wouldn’t go near a soda pop, but they had no qualms about stomping a guy for smoking weed. They really couldn’t wait for that kind of thing. It was weird to see all this ascetic suppression, and how they were still hunting for this kind of transcendence and intensity through violence.
The pillow fight flash-mob element popped in because I read some folks were complaining about that sort of thing and I thought, “Do you know what kind of terrible shit those kids could be up to?”
>Will the strongest survive, or the smartest? And it seems to end in favor of strength. Or does it?
Wish I knew where I finally landed on these questions. There are so many different types of strength now. I think about it all the time, and it puts my mind somewhere between having hope for a constantly evolving human race and a hopeless damnation of the whole species. Depends on my mood and what was on the news that day. I think I’m most scared of smart people—with powerful weapons—who are incapable of thoughtfully moving beyond their animal natures. And it brings to mind this quote from Robert Heinlein:
“Anyone who clings to the historically untrue — and — thoroughly immoral doctrine that violence never solves anything I would advise to conjure up the ghosts of Napoleon Bonaparte and the Duke of Wellington and let them debate it. The ghost of Hitler would referee. Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor; and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and their freedoms.”
Hope you enjoy the rest of the book when you get around to it!
jyh
from VA is reading whatever he feels likeMay 23, 2012 - 5:21pm
Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor; and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst.
No offense to you JRJ, (this is just a tangent,) but I think Heinlein is full of shit.
I guess it depends on what one considers to be an "issue." Do only those things which lead to fights/wars count as issues? If so, Heinlein's point is self-proving and ultimately irrelevant. But no one solved the issue of how to improve crop-growing using irrigation by way of violence. (You might say, in some cases, they solved the shortage of labor by way of slavery, which is a form of violence.)
One could argue that many "issues" exist only because of the perceived threat of violence from the "other," that if violence were not endemic to our race there would actually be fewer issues. In other words, if we consider violence itself to be an "issue," it will not be solved by violence (unless you just destroy everybody, super-villain-style) and Heinlein is therefore a chump. If brute force is acceptable, why not have the smart ones just breed violence out of the species by way of genetic engineering, a long, protracted, intelligent violence against people who'd rather fuck over others than work things out? It makes more sense than promoting it.
I'm by no means a hippy, but this sort of thing always gets under my brain-skin.
*puts soap back into the box*
Flaminia Ferina
from Umbria is reading stuffMay 25, 2012 - 5:10pm
Hi Jeremy, thank you for taking time to answer my questions. Hours spent reading your book are well spent. Congratulations, really.
I hope I can get back soon in the conversation, cause it's interesting big time, but it's 2 a.m. here and times are hectic.
For the moment I'll just take a risk, saying yes, the points that J.Y. raises are valid, but the matter here seems not be whether brute force is acceptable. Point is some individuals will only, and I stress only, understand violence, because violence is the only language they dig. No reasoning, no good examples, no bona fide. And this is terrible. Most of us are looking for a way around brute force I guess. Breeding violence out of the species by means of genetic engineering seems to me just another form of violence, like you already say, JY. Pretty intense and centered on humans, and on what, and under which conditions, some humans will decide is to be eliminated from other humans, at least.
And idiocy, I fear, would just find its way back into the DNA, the sneaky bastard.
Plane dropping countless condoms on a regular, extensive basis could be a solution, too bad I sense the wrong people would just keep ignoring them.
Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.May 31, 2012 - 3:31pm
I think the context is important on the Heinlein quote as it probably stems from the time when he was stumping for nuclear escalation to end/win WWII. He was an ex-Navy guy, and probably not hip at the time to what Gandhi was doing overseas (or, obviously, what MLK might do with non-violence in the future). Just some provocative, hawkish agitation that underlines, for me, the kind of fears of our brute, animal natures which creep up around 3 AM.
And from a semantic point of view, he probably could have used “conflict” vs. “issue” in that statement and got closer to what it seems he was aiming at.
It was either in a Nova special on dogs (or maybe a documentary on eugenics), where they showed the effects of the longest-known breeding experiment, which was taking place in Siberia. They’d been breeding these silver foxes for generations according to either docility or aggression, and turned the gentle side into house pets while the other line was more feral than ever. But I wondered how either batch would fare if released into the wild, and I couldn’t help but imagine what kind of nightmare would occur if they were both released at the same time.
I’ve been to parties where they dropped hundreds of condoms on the attendees. Just made the lonely people feel lonelier while the people who needed them were probably already off in some dark corner or car or the woods going at it like angry Siberian foxes.
At the end of the day I feel like “Keep hope alive but never turn your back on humanity’s animal instincts.” is a safe bet.
All that being said, I think this is the last “official” day of the WLIY book discussion, and I want to thank everyone who checked out the book or participated so far. So, THANKS!
And I want to thank the LitReactor crew for selecting WE LIVE INSIDE YOU and having me here. It’s been an honor, and great fun too.
OtisTheBulldog
from Somerville, MA is reading The Brief Wondrous Life of Oscar Wao by Junot DiazMay 31, 2012 - 3:33pm
Thanks for participating, too. High fives all around!
jyh
from VA is reading whatever he feels likeMay 31, 2012 - 3:42pm
I saw that special on dog breeding. It was fascinating. And yeah, the docile foxes might not do well in the wild, but the implications for humanity are still there. Supposedly a key facet of the human race is our adaptability, our ability to act as the situation demands. The use of force when necessary (as in self-defense or a preemptive strike) is a different phenomenon from its use by default (as a predator.) Necessity will always be up for debate, of course.
Flaminia Ferina
from Umbria is reading stuffJune 1, 2012 - 2:34am
Yes, thank you Jeremy, and all the readers here.
See you around, maybe even back here again in the next future.
Pete
from Detroit is reading Red DragonJune 1, 2012 - 5:41am
Thanks Jeremy! And remember, the thread can always be bumped whenever. It can never die!
Americantypo
from Philadelphia is reading The Bone ClocksJuly 7, 2012 - 9:04am
Speaking of this thread never dying, I just started the book and am really bummed I couldn't particpate in the discussion! It's a really great collection thus far in reading it and I'm about a third of the way through.
Pete
from Detroit is reading Red DragonJuly 7, 2012 - 7:26pm
Post your thoughts when you get around to them! We'll still chime in.
Americantypo
from Philadelphia is reading The Bone ClocksJuly 8, 2012 - 3:34pm
Hm... well, I just like the book a lot. It's got a nice variety of work in it. The horror stuff is solid and the weird/bizarro stuff is done very well. Only half way through, so I won't post my favorites until I've finished it.
Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.August 8, 2012 - 2:48pm
Hey, Americantypo--Thanks for checking it out!
I'm always lurking, seldom posting (Iost my only babysitter in March, so it's always a hustle here), but I'll continue to respond to posts here.
As a side note, WLIY recently had a couple of very cool reviews, for anyone interested:
HORROR TALK-- "A genre-bending mix of stories akin to a literary blitzkrieg."
VERBICIDE-- "We Live Inside You continues to showcase the author’s staggering ability to craft stories as poignant as they are strange."
Americantypo
from Philadelphia is reading The Bone ClocksAugust 10, 2012 - 9:52am
Cool. I'm still reading it, ha ha. I read like one story between books and I'm juggling the Hyperion series and Game of Thrones, so it's taking me forever to read it. It's great stuff. I'm gonna guess that you're a fan of "Monsters Inside Me" or whatever it's called on the nature channel. My ex HATED it but I couldn't get enough of the show. There's some pretty clever bugs out there.
-Bill
Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.November 6, 2012 - 3:16pm
Bill--I consume pretty much any parasite-based media I can locate. PARASITE REX by Carl Zimmer was excellent. Thanks for wedging me in as a palate cleanser between Simmons and Martin. That's a cool place to be.
In semi-related news, 21C Magazine just posted a genuinely epic interview with me, discussing "Bizarro, David Cronenberg, parasites and, inevitably, the end of the world."
And tomorrow I'll be on the Books and Booze podcast, which should air shortly after.
Class Facilitator
ReneeAPickup
from Southern California is reading Wanderers by Chuck WendigNovember 6, 2012 - 3:50pm
Thursday between 1-2pm PST. :D
Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.November 7, 2012 - 10:49am
Cool. Thanks, Sparrow! I'm ready:
avery of the dead
from Kentucky is reading Cipher SistersNovember 7, 2012 - 10:51am
Note to self - only ask questions about Bizarro
Class Facilitator
ReneeAPickup
from Southern California is reading Wanderers by Chuck WendigNovember 7, 2012 - 12:27pm
I can't wait for our En Espanol episode!! Also, Apocolypse IPA, eh?
Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.November 13, 2012 - 11:09am
Well, here's the new Books and Booze episode, and as promised/threatened I got drunk, answered questions in mangled Spanish, and sang a ridiculously spot on Doobie Brothers cover.
And we had some actual, bonafide conversations about writing and literature, which was fun too.
Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.December 11, 2012 - 12:10pm
WE LIVE INSIDE YOU won a very heavy chunk of decorated glass! So that was nice!
I submitted WLIY for the 2013 Oregon Book Award too, but who am I kidding? With a two-headed monster on the cover, I'm guessing WLIY got used for a coaster while the judges moved on to Pauls Toutonghi's book. But you never know. It's more fun to hope, right?
sean of the dead
from Madisonville, KY is reading Peckerwood, by Jed AyresDecember 11, 2012 - 1:01pm
After hearing that episode of Books & Booze and reading a couple short stories in the Bizarro magazine/starter kit, I am super excited to read Averydoll's copy of We Live Inside You. She speaks highly of this book!
Maybe that Books & Booze show is worth a damn after all...(insert silly emoticon here to indicate internet sarcasm/teasing)
Jeremy Robert J...
from Portland, OR is reading an unreasonable number of books.December 11, 2012 - 2:06pm
Thanks, Sean! Hope you enjoy the book once you jack it from Averydoll.
Man, Books & Booze is cool, right?. That's the most fun I've had in an interview this year. Definitely the most singing I've done.
Class Facilitator
ReneeAPickup
from Southern California is reading Wanderers by Chuck WendigDecember 11, 2012 - 2:59pm
D'awww thanks. We try to have a good time.
Class Facilitator
ReneeAPickup
from Southern California is reading Wanderers by Chuck WendigDecember 11, 2012 - 3:06pm
Also, I stole that quote and put it up on the site, hahaha.
JYH—I enjoy really skillful exposition, in the hands of somebody like Cody Goodfellow or James Ellroy (who does an amazing job in AMERICAN TABLOID at dropping huge amounts of exposition in between the more emotional character-driven sections). But my exposition usually clunks when I do it in chunks, so I try to weave in back story and world-building through more subtle character observations and trust the reader to fill in the gaps.
Very early on I used to open up with a lot of scenery and character description until I got a workshop note from a lady named Nina Kiriki Hoffman. It was three pages into the story, and her note just read:
“Your story begins here!”
And she was so right. Ever since then I’ve gone for the high conflict “in media res” opening, often in the form of a character thought that can almost be seen as a thesis statement (although sometimes it’s just a provocation).
Forms of exposition I am guilty of having used in the past: The Bad Guy Lecture, The Scientist’s Explanation, and the rightly reviled Tangential Character Telling the Central Character Something They Would Obviously Already Have Known. If I knew I was using one of these, I kept it as short and tight as possible. Lessen the degree of the sin, I guess.
I’m also guilty of using Character Description Given Via Self-Assessment in Mirror, but that’s a whole other issue.
Flaminia—Nice to hear from you, and glad the book reached your new location. Thanks for cracking the thing open; hope you enjoy it when the time is right. In the meantime, enjoy the sunshine and potential future husbands.
Otis—Thanks! Really nice to hear “Trigger Variation” worked for you. As Pete points out, there are some derivative elements in there (the odes to Fight Club and The Warriors are pretty overt), but this was, I think, my last “disturbed child of an alcoholic” story (see also: “Dissociative Skills”, “Saturn’s Game”, “Cortical Reorganization”, etc.) and I feel like the ending finally exorcised a lot of my feelings on the matter. I’ve now transitioned from a son to a neurotic father, which led me to a much-increased level of empathy for parents, and stories like “Cathedral Mother” and “Laws of Virulence.”
“States of Glass” was another story, like “Persistence Hunting,” that I vacillated on including, but I’m glad it’s in there, and I appreciate your and Pete’s comments.
I don’t personally read in genre. I read writers, and I’ll follow a great writer into whatever kind of story they want to tell. I just have to hope that people who dig the weirder stuff will find something to like in a story like “States of Glass.” So far there hasn’t been too much static about WE LIVE INSIDE YOU having so much less overtly Bizarro content than ANGEL DUST APOCALYPSE, which is cool.
Pete—Man, you’re thorough. This rivals your epic WARMED & BOUND session…
Sounds like that fungus could make for an awesome story. Just the visual of all those human bodies amassing on some huge tree until the branches broke with their weight, that could be great. Skipp and Goodfellow did a fungal zombie book for Leisure called SPORE that’s sitting on my TBR. Makes me want to move it forward in the queue.
Thanks for mentioning “Consumerism.” That’s about as close as I get to writing comedy, though it’s kind of pitch black. But I had a lot of fun writing that and its predecessor “Priapism.” Both were inspired, somehow, maybe tonally, by the Incandenza mattress fixing scene from INFINITE JEST.
Re: Musty Cow’s Teat of Death—There’s a reason that’s in the B-Sides section, and I try to warn people in the lead-in, about how odd that thing is. There’s a slim narrative in there about two neighbors and a dog and a barbecue, but it’s mostly buried by the contrivances of the experimental form. I think it’s fun as an experiment, and I dig how playful and silly the language is (some really funny sentences, I think), but it’s definitely way fucking out there.
That Courage the Cowardly Dog comic is about perfect (though the ending of “Mercy” is a little more “lady or the tiger”).
At the HPL Film Fest this weekend for three days of weird movies, books, and beer. See you guys on Monday.
I wanted to say a little something about each of the stories I really liked. I guess I didn't realize I had really liked most of them.
What happened with the Warmed and Bound discussion was this - if every one of those authors that said they wanted to discuss the book would have made just 1 post, it would have been a great discussion. But instead, barely anybody posted (including readers). Meanwhile I know a shitload of people read the book. I decided to try something crazy to spark discussion. Didn't really work, but it was an awesome exercise.
Also - You just sold me on Spore, and maybe my first Skipp and Goodfellow all in one read.
Mustycow’steatofdeath™
JRJ said:
So, I've finally managed some time alone in the mountains and read good part of WLIY.
I'm loving it. Jeremy, your style is fresh and amusing.
The Oarsman: an anti-labelling tale, as I see it. In my mind it sounded like a big fuck you to all those who think they can take others' lives in their hands and declare apocalypse for all. I might have taken it backwards, though.
“Earth, optimistically referred to as Colony 1.” This phrase, golden, gives a practical account of how well condensed is the sentencing in this first story.
When Susurrur Stirs: One of the best in the collection. At this point I had very well become acquainted with your voice. At page 20 I was totally sucked in. I appreciate a good story in 1st person plural.
- Did the idea spawn from a desire of writing in 1st plural, or was this voice the most natural for the account? I am investigating rituals and other phenomena involving possession. Like demonic possession and stuff, so I really dig this story as being about a particular way of being possessed. By a less spiritual entity, maybe.
- I sense a holistic aftertaste to the first 2 stories already. Is this approach part of your cultural background?
Persistence Hunting: This is in second person. I haven't read many collections, but the way you experiment with different voices makes the experience entertaining. We have a guy who gets a high from burglary here, great point of view. You got me laugh out loud at “slaughtered by a Jetta with a butterfly bumper sticker.”
“the heat from her face mixing nicely with your valium/brain damage buzz,” very evocative.
I must say I really appreciate the sexual fantasies you set on the table (like getting aroused by sneaking into houses, I can relate to it). With a dominating culture continually force feeding us lethally boring and gross sex imagery, this comes in like a new kind of springtime.
Snortland. New nomenclature :)
“alternative badass, one who wouldn't trap her in jealousy.” Thank you for this.
And thank you for the Rottweiler named Scarface. I'm a sucker for big dogs' scary names.
The Witness at Dawn: beautiful ghost tale.
Consumerism: An unreliable and haunting narrator. I hope you'll write a novel with Ron and his father. I definitely want to know more about them. The whole idea spells disaster.
“The sun is rising. Your dark night of the soul is over, Ron..” How can't you just love this man? A thrilling kind of love that keeps you away and safe from people like him, of course.
I like the Iroquois culture references.
Trigger Variation: My favorite. Detached 3rd person narration. The main character is awesomely developed. Very up-to-date with all the ganging going on in the world.
“Gorilla physique. A guy prone to misunderstanding nuance.” Description that doesn't need more words.
“Jackson cancelled his query/feigned mental drift.” Gold. Is it just your personal affinity with slashes, or you figured they're particularly suited to render a split personality?
“It was ape heaven.” I'm still giggling at this.
Did you get the idea for this story from a pillow fight flashmob? From a “what if those pillows were filled with iron” frame of thought?
The story raises important questions about preservation of the species: Will the strongest survive, or the smartest? And it seems to end in favor of strength. Or does it?
“Born-again savages.” Is there a reference to the primitivists in Eugene? This is just a lol question.
Enough for now.
Flaminia_Klla/Cris—Thanks for spending some time in the mountains with my weird book.
Re: When Susurrus Stirs, I thought that using the “We” would be the easiest way to convey a sense of the hive mind, to make the narration more progressively alien as the human voice was subsumed into the ancient perspective of something which didn’t have an ego or conscience to inhibit the forces of consuming and breeding. And also, yeah, I did just want to try it to see if I could make it work as an idea and still tell the story.
If there’s a holistic sensibility present, that must be one of those things my subconscious is coughing up without letting me know…
Re: Consumerism, I don’t know if I could sustain Ron’s father’s voice for novel length (plus- poor Ron). It takes a while to churn up all that pompous verbal abuse.
Re: Trigger Variation, I really like the forward slashes as a quick way to condense information and establish a kind of staccato rhythm to the language, esp. when the story is on the hard-boiled end of things.
The story was partly inspired by the ultra straight edge Hardline movement and by some of the straight edge folks I knew when I lived in Olympia. These guys wouldn’t go near a soda pop, but they had no qualms about stomping a guy for smoking weed. They really couldn’t wait for that kind of thing. It was weird to see all this ascetic suppression, and how they were still hunting for this kind of transcendence and intensity through violence.
The pillow fight flash-mob element popped in because I read some folks were complaining about that sort of thing and I thought, “Do you know what kind of terrible shit those kids could be up to?”
>Will the strongest survive, or the smartest? And it seems to end in favor of strength. Or does it?
Wish I knew where I finally landed on these questions. There are so many different types of strength now. I think about it all the time, and it puts my mind somewhere between having hope for a constantly evolving human race and a hopeless damnation of the whole species. Depends on my mood and what was on the news that day. I think I’m most scared of smart people—with powerful weapons—who are incapable of thoughtfully moving beyond their animal natures. And it brings to mind this quote from Robert Heinlein:
“Anyone who clings to the historically untrue — and — thoroughly immoral doctrine that violence never solves anything I would advise to conjure up the ghosts of Napoleon Bonaparte and the Duke of Wellington and let them debate it. The ghost of Hitler would referee. Violence, naked force, has settled more issues in history than has any other factor; and the contrary opinion is wishful thinking at its worst. Breeds that forget this basic truth have always paid for it with their lives and their freedoms.”
Hope you enjoy the rest of the book when you get around to it!
No offense to you JRJ, (this is just a tangent,) but I think Heinlein is full of shit.
I guess it depends on what one considers to be an "issue." Do only those things which lead to fights/wars count as issues? If so, Heinlein's point is self-proving and ultimately irrelevant. But no one solved the issue of how to improve crop-growing using irrigation by way of violence. (You might say, in some cases, they solved the shortage of labor by way of slavery, which is a form of violence.)
One could argue that many "issues" exist only because of the perceived threat of violence from the "other," that if violence were not endemic to our race there would actually be fewer issues. In other words, if we consider violence itself to be an "issue," it will not be solved by violence (unless you just destroy everybody, super-villain-style) and Heinlein is therefore a chump. If brute force is acceptable, why not have the smart ones just breed violence out of the species by way of genetic engineering, a long, protracted, intelligent violence against people who'd rather fuck over others than work things out? It makes more sense than promoting it.
I'm by no means a hippy, but this sort of thing always gets under my brain-skin.
*puts soap back into the box*
Hi Jeremy, thank you for taking time to answer my questions. Hours spent reading your book are well spent. Congratulations, really.
I hope I can get back soon in the conversation, cause it's interesting big time, but it's 2 a.m. here and times are hectic.
For the moment I'll just take a risk, saying yes, the points that J.Y. raises are valid, but the matter here seems not be whether brute force is acceptable. Point is some individuals will only, and I stress only, understand violence, because violence is the only language they dig. No reasoning, no good examples, no bona fide. And this is terrible. Most of us are looking for a way around brute force I guess. Breeding violence out of the species by means of genetic engineering seems to me just another form of violence, like you already say, JY. Pretty intense and centered on humans, and on what, and under which conditions, some humans will decide is to be eliminated from other humans, at least.
And idiocy, I fear, would just find its way back into the DNA, the sneaky bastard.
Plane dropping countless condoms on a regular, extensive basis could be a solution, too bad I sense the wrong people would just keep ignoring them.
I think the context is important on the Heinlein quote as it probably stems from the time when he was stumping for nuclear escalation to end/win WWII. He was an ex-Navy guy, and probably not hip at the time to what Gandhi was doing overseas (or, obviously, what MLK might do with non-violence in the future). Just some provocative, hawkish agitation that underlines, for me, the kind of fears of our brute, animal natures which creep up around 3 AM.
And from a semantic point of view, he probably could have used “conflict” vs. “issue” in that statement and got closer to what it seems he was aiming at.
It was either in a Nova special on dogs (or maybe a documentary on eugenics), where they showed the effects of the longest-known breeding experiment, which was taking place in Siberia. They’d been breeding these silver foxes for generations according to either docility or aggression, and turned the gentle side into house pets while the other line was more feral than ever. But I wondered how either batch would fare if released into the wild, and I couldn’t help but imagine what kind of nightmare would occur if they were both released at the same time.
I’ve been to parties where they dropped hundreds of condoms on the attendees. Just made the lonely people feel lonelier while the people who needed them were probably already off in some dark corner or car or the woods going at it like angry Siberian foxes.
At the end of the day I feel like “Keep hope alive but never turn your back on humanity’s animal instincts.” is a safe bet.
All that being said, I think this is the last “official” day of the WLIY book discussion, and I want to thank everyone who checked out the book or participated so far. So, THANKS!
And I want to thank the LitReactor crew for selecting WE LIVE INSIDE YOU and having me here. It’s been an honor, and great fun too.
Thanks for participating, too. High fives all around!
I saw that special on dog breeding. It was fascinating. And yeah, the docile foxes might not do well in the wild, but the implications for humanity are still there. Supposedly a key facet of the human race is our adaptability, our ability to act as the situation demands. The use of force when necessary (as in self-defense or a preemptive strike) is a different phenomenon from its use by default (as a predator.) Necessity will always be up for debate, of course.
Yes, thank you Jeremy, and all the readers here.
See you around, maybe even back here again in the next future.
Thanks Jeremy! And remember, the thread can always be bumped whenever. It can never die!
Speaking of this thread never dying, I just started the book and am really bummed I couldn't particpate in the discussion! It's a really great collection thus far in reading it and I'm about a third of the way through.
Post your thoughts when you get around to them! We'll still chime in.
Hm... well, I just like the book a lot. It's got a nice variety of work in it. The horror stuff is solid and the weird/bizarro stuff is done very well. Only half way through, so I won't post my favorites until I've finished it.
Hey, Americantypo--Thanks for checking it out!
I'm always lurking, seldom posting (Iost my only babysitter in March, so it's always a hustle here), but I'll continue to respond to posts here.
As a side note, WLIY recently had a couple of very cool reviews, for anyone interested:
HORROR TALK-- "A genre-bending mix of stories akin to a literary blitzkrieg."
VERBICIDE-- "We Live Inside You continues to showcase the author’s staggering ability to craft stories as poignant as they are strange."
Cool. I'm still reading it, ha ha. I read like one story between books and I'm juggling the Hyperion series and Game of Thrones, so it's taking me forever to read it. It's great stuff. I'm gonna guess that you're a fan of "Monsters Inside Me" or whatever it's called on the nature channel. My ex HATED it but I couldn't get enough of the show. There's some pretty clever bugs out there.
-Bill
Bill--I consume pretty much any parasite-based media I can locate. PARASITE REX by Carl Zimmer was excellent. Thanks for wedging me in as a palate cleanser between Simmons and Martin. That's a cool place to be.
In semi-related news, 21C Magazine just posted a genuinely epic interview with me, discussing "Bizarro, David Cronenberg, parasites and, inevitably, the end of the world."
And tomorrow I'll be on the Books and Booze podcast, which should air shortly after.
Thursday between 1-2pm PST. :D
Cool. Thanks, Sparrow! I'm ready:
Note to self - only ask questions about Bizarro
I can't wait for our En Espanol episode!! Also, Apocolypse IPA, eh?
Well, here's the new Books and Booze episode, and as promised/threatened I got drunk, answered questions in mangled Spanish, and sang a ridiculously spot on Doobie Brothers cover.
And we had some actual, bonafide conversations about writing and literature, which was fun too.
WE LIVE INSIDE YOU won a very heavy chunk of decorated glass! So that was nice!
I submitted WLIY for the 2013 Oregon Book Award too, but who am I kidding? With a two-headed monster on the cover, I'm guessing WLIY got used for a coaster while the judges moved on to Pauls Toutonghi's book. But you never know. It's more fun to hope, right?
After hearing that episode of Books & Booze and reading a couple short stories in the Bizarro magazine/starter kit, I am super excited to read Averydoll's copy of We Live Inside You. She speaks highly of this book!
Maybe that Books & Booze show is worth a damn after all...(insert silly emoticon here to indicate internet sarcasm/teasing)
Thanks, Sean! Hope you enjoy the book once you jack it from Averydoll.
Man, Books & Booze is cool, right?. That's the most fun I've had in an interview this year. Definitely the most singing I've done.
D'awww thanks. We try to have a good time.
Also, I stole that quote and put it up on the site, hahaha.