Renfield
from Hell is reading 20th Century GhostsMarch 8, 2012 - 4:34am
Yall think 3rd person limited is so popular in mainstream fiction because it's so easily adaptable for the screen? Or is it just that it gives you enough room to tell a larger view of a largely plot-based story? /drunken musings.
Matt Attack
from Richmond, Va. is reading As I Lay Dying, William FaulknerMarch 8, 2012 - 11:38am
I like your drunken ramblings. Somehow it made sense. I say 3rd gives you a bigger picture feel, 1st is internal. Just my thoughts though...
Fritz
March 8, 2012 - 11:58am
Got to remember. 3rd limited isnt pure objective (like a movie). 3rd limited can be and is just as internal as 1st. Its just a change in perspective. As for smaller / larger pictures / worlds and the plot driven story?, i dont see how POV affect that. That stuff is writer's choice. (work-brainwave, wish i was drinking ramble). Really like that thought process. Tickles the muse
Matt Attack
from Richmond, Va. is reading As I Lay Dying, William FaulknerMarch 8, 2012 - 12:06pm
Ha, "tickles the muse" I am stealing that.
Bob Pastorella
from Groves, Texas is reading murder books trying to stay hip, I'm thinking of you, and you're out there so Say your prayers, Say your prayers, Say your prayers March 8, 2012 - 9:42pm
Lately I've been writing my 3rd person narrative as though I am writing first person, yet writing about another character with no reference to the narrator. There is never an 'I' or 'my'. The first person narrator is NOT a character in the story. This method allows me to have a 'voice' with the narrator rather than a generic all knowing narrator with no personality. James Ellroy is the master of this, but writers have been doing it for years.
Fritz
March 8, 2012 - 9:46pm
Bob - well said - better than I. It is a good method to practice.
Class Facilitator
ReneeAPickup
from Southern California is reading Wanderers by Chuck WendigMarch 9, 2012 - 2:08pm
Bob--I do that, too. It comes with it's own challenges, though. Sometimes I think "damn, this would be easier if I could get into taht character's head without it looking pasted in".
Arkadia
from Australia is reading Selected Poems by W.H. AudenMarch 9, 2012 - 2:58pm
It makes me so sad when I hear writers say they pretty much 'only' write from one perspective. To me, messing around with different perspectives is half the fun! I think it's truly story-based. Some stories work well with a flying camera, some hit you in the gut much harder when they're told from the perspective of a friend. As a writer you should be highly adaptable when it comes to perspective. I mean, I am no great writer, but I found my prose improved a thousand times when I made the effort to switch it up between first/third/the occasional second person perspective. Nowadays when I sit down to write there is no question of perspective - I generally just write in the one that feels most 'natural' to the story. If you find you tend to stick to first, or third, or (freak) second, I'd recommend writing a few stories from the other side, loosen you up a little. That flexibility is a great thing to have.
Second person perspective? I think when it works, it really works. Some stories can't be told without employing the use of second person, so it's really inspiring and novel when you find a great SPP story. I tend to think of them as two different kinds of stories -- one kind employs the word you as if we're peeking in on a letter written to a third party, and one is directly addressing the reader, turning them into a character in the story. Both can be great. I very rarely write in second person, but thinking about it, I don't see why we as writers shouldn't practice it as much as we practice the other perspectives. It may well be that second person doesn't seem to be effective because very few people are good at it. Because few people really try their hand at it.
Alllllllll speculation.
Anyway. Perspectives are super fun.
Bob Pastorella
from Groves, Texas is reading murder books trying to stay hip, I'm thinking of you, and you're out there so Say your prayers, Say your prayers, Say your prayers March 9, 2012 - 8:12pm
Bob--I do that, too. It comes with it's own challenges, though. Sometimes I think "damn, this would be easier if I could get into taht character's head without it looking pasted in".
I hear you, but if you use 3rd person limited with multiple characters, you can alter the voice to fit the character. I think a lot of people get confused about the limited part, which means, from what I understand, limited to one perspective at a time, not one perspective through the entire story. If you have multiple perspectives, you can distance yourself or get in as close as you need to. The trick is to make the voice unique and still have a sense of style. Like I said, read some of James Ellroy's Underworld Trilogy, especially the first one American Tabloid. He writes in the same style through the whole novel, but you immediately know whose head you are in from the first sentence of each perspective change.
Lonesome Dove is a great example of 3rd person unlimited, also called 3rd person omnipotent. He would change perspectives within a scene, jumping from character to character, which is fine because it worked for that novel, but it doesn't work today, or at least there aren't too many novels written like that today. Justin Cronin's The Passage has over 17 different perspectives, each in 3rd person limited, and he manages to make each character unique and intriguing, and necessary due to the scope of the story.
Class Facilitator
ReneeAPickup
from Southern California is reading Wanderers by Chuck WendigMarch 9, 2012 - 8:50pm
Oh I know, I do a fair amount of true 3rd limited--but I have a couple where I wrote so much from one perspective that sticking other characters' perspective in seemed really awkward. Perhaps that is a comment on my ability, though.
underpurplemoon
from PDX
May 21, 2012 - 2:52am
I think I write in first person a lot. I do first, second and third all in one body of writing sometimes too. I don't think consistency is a strong quality I possess.
I think the last book in the Twilight series had the first part of the book be narrated by the protagonist, and then the second part be narrated by another character. The third part, back to the protagonist's point of view.
Third person is difficult for me. I'll focus more on first person from now on, rather than jumping a lot.
Yall think 3rd person limited is so popular in mainstream fiction because it's so easily adaptable for the screen? Or is it just that it gives you enough room to tell a larger view of a largely plot-based story? /drunken musings.
I like your drunken ramblings. Somehow it made sense. I say 3rd gives you a bigger picture feel, 1st is internal. Just my thoughts though...
Got to remember. 3rd limited isnt pure objective (like a movie). 3rd limited can be and is just as internal as 1st. Its just a change in perspective. As for smaller / larger pictures / worlds and the plot driven story?, i dont see how POV affect that. That stuff is writer's choice. (work-brainwave, wish i was drinking ramble). Really like that thought process. Tickles the muse
Ha, "tickles the muse" I am stealing that.
Lately I've been writing my 3rd person narrative as though I am writing first person, yet writing about another character with no reference to the narrator. There is never an 'I' or 'my'. The first person narrator is NOT a character in the story. This method allows me to have a 'voice' with the narrator rather than a generic all knowing narrator with no personality. James Ellroy is the master of this, but writers have been doing it for years.
Bob - well said - better than I. It is a good method to practice.
Bob--I do that, too. It comes with it's own challenges, though. Sometimes I think "damn, this would be easier if I could get into taht character's head without it looking pasted in".
It makes me so sad when I hear writers say they pretty much 'only' write from one perspective. To me, messing around with different perspectives is half the fun! I think it's truly story-based. Some stories work well with a flying camera, some hit you in the gut much harder when they're told from the perspective of a friend. As a writer you should be highly adaptable when it comes to perspective. I mean, I am no great writer, but I found my prose improved a thousand times when I made the effort to switch it up between first/third/the occasional second person perspective. Nowadays when I sit down to write there is no question of perspective - I generally just write in the one that feels most 'natural' to the story. If you find you tend to stick to first, or third, or (freak) second, I'd recommend writing a few stories from the other side, loosen you up a little. That flexibility is a great thing to have.
Second person perspective? I think when it works, it really works. Some stories can't be told without employing the use of second person, so it's really inspiring and novel when you find a great SPP story. I tend to think of them as two different kinds of stories -- one kind employs the word you as if we're peeking in on a letter written to a third party, and one is directly addressing the reader, turning them into a character in the story. Both can be great. I very rarely write in second person, but thinking about it, I don't see why we as writers shouldn't practice it as much as we practice the other perspectives. It may well be that second person doesn't seem to be effective because very few people are good at it. Because few people really try their hand at it.
Alllllllll speculation.
Anyway. Perspectives are super fun.
Oh I know, I do a fair amount of true 3rd limited--but I have a couple where I wrote so much from one perspective that sticking other characters' perspective in seemed really awkward. Perhaps that is a comment on my ability, though.
I think I write in first person a lot. I do first, second and third all in one body of writing sometimes too. I don't think consistency is a strong quality I possess.
I think the last book in the Twilight series had the first part of the book be narrated by the protagonist, and then the second part be narrated by another character. The third part, back to the protagonist's point of view.
Third person is difficult for me. I'll focus more on first person from now on, rather than jumping a lot.